Who needs the F/A 22, 5th generation combat aircraft

What does anyone think about the first flight of the Russian version of the F-22?When the F-22 production was cut to some 186 aircraft, I was not surprised but the reason given other than cost was the F-15/ F-16/ F-18 would be able to handle future threats did leave me dumb founded.

not much but it looks pretty im not seeing much space for internal ordnance storage and we dont know alot about its potential sensors but what the russians are doing that is smart is making this affordable to other counties that might want to buy them . I also think that buying the latest model F-15/16 and F/A-18 would leave us in a good postion for our air defense and would lessen the blow if the F-35 with all of its unproven technology isnt all that its clamied to be



Its F-22A btw

Russian version?
Nice trolling ;)

his name is warTROLLED. besides this is more the missing link between the F-15 and the F-22

Plus it's not an operational version, this is just a testing version, it has tons of unstealthy probes sticking out everywhere, no RAM, no 3D TVC, and has a HUD. So for now, we just have a baseline look of what PAK-FA will be.

Also, it's the child of the YF-23 & Su-27, giving it the designation Su-50.
23 + 27 = 50

claiming PAK-FA a version of some american plane is either

a ) complete lack of aviation knowledge
or
b ) childish dishing of some desing to troll or start a flame figth.

And In my forum, I dont want to see either one taking place.

The Russians are capable of building anything equal to what the West can produce. It has done so for sixty-odd years and with the MiG-29 and Su-27 in the 1980s actually leapfrogged the West. If it wasn't for those two types the Typhoon and F-22A would not be the aircraft they are today.

Personally I think the F-22 is over-hyped, over-technical and over-expensive but if the F-35 really can be made to work (preferably before 2020!) it will be a huge leap in fighter performance.

Let's not forget India wants in on the PAK-FA programme, plus South Korea and Japan wants home-built or US fifth generation fighters and no dobut China will pull out a stealthy fighter within the next 5 years.

F-22 overhyped? More like the F-35 is overhyped. Shit stealth(Good only against X-band Radar head-on), performance suffers due to weight(weights about as much as a F-15), and will likely end up costing as much as the F-22 due to procurement cuts(already started now that Raptor's dead)! :angry:

/rant

Anywho, Golly's right. While PAK-FA does look somewhat like an American stealth fighter, that's only due to the fact that so far, there's only 3 known ways to build a manned Stealth aircraft; Flying Wing, Diamond shard, & Platform Alinement.

And as for the Chinese Stealth Fighter, given how previous Chinese fighters are released, we'll get confirmation of it in 2045. :rolleyes: Damn secretive bastards... stop teasing us avaition fanatics.

In the various PAK-FA threads that I have read over many forums I keep hearing about how we need to build 50 gibillion F-22/F-35's because of Russia's PAK-FA or China's JXX or the Imperial TIE fighter yadda yadda yadda but I never see the one question. How many can they afford to build? Hi tech is highly expensive. The days of the USSR building 40-60 aircraft a month are over. Its more like 30-40 a year. Like the West. (and I might be hiballing that figure) While Russia's economy is in better shape compared to the mess throughout most of the 90's they still are struggling to modernize their military. China is going full bore to bring their military up to date but they have reduced the manpower in their military because of the cost of all the new toys that show up every other week.

THE WORLD IS BROKE FOLKS. You may not see it in your personal lives but I see how governments are struggling with their debt and buying more toys for boys isn't in their top ten list right now. Look at Great Britain. They have reduced their armed forces to a mere shadow of what it once was. The Daring right now is basiclly an overpriced Coast Guard cutter because they couldn't afford to put all the doo dads in the ship at the time of completion. Will the CVF ever be built? I don't see a Trident sub follow on and has their new attack boat been commissoned yet? Has a second attack boat started construction yet? Tank production shut down.

So Russia finally rolled out their prototype. IMO they be lucky to have 100 of them by 2020.

I think it's reasonable to claim that PAK-FA is "inspired" by F-22, but only in the sense that any aircraft is inspired by predecessors in that mission. PAK-FA is surely its own creation, with some very interesting features of its own. Note how over the frontal arcs, it is as dedicated to low observables as F-22... meanwhile, move to the back of the airframe and it's all aerodynamics, with no regard to radar (or especially IR!) stealth. PAK-FA can quite reasonably be taken to be an offensive, air superiority platform. No need for (general) all-aspect stealthiness for ingress-egress strike; the very shape of the aircraft itself indicates the mission Russia intends.

I encourage members to download five or ten high resolution images of PAK-FA (or indeed, of anything else) and try to glean relevant details. It's a great exercise in analytical thinking.

every plane is inspired by other planes, expecially those who pioneer in something. ' ;)
But a version out of some plane usually means that something to build around existing airframe using it as basis.

I think that new technology is great. Some designs are ground breaking.
But as noted else where the cost per unit is so high that large purchases are unrealistic. (and the reduced production runs end up costing more per unit)

It is said that quality beats quantity, but at some point quantity trumps quality.
As the high-tech militaries shrink in size, they actually become more vulnerable.
When you have limited numbers of units, the loss of a single one can be a significant factor.

There doesn't seem to be any solution in this rush for higher tech. If the trend continues, in a decade, a nation will be able to afford 1 new ship or aircraft a year.

Do we really need the units with the most bells & whistles or do we need combat units that can perform their mission in realistic numbers?

Picking up dreadnoughts point; news breaking in the U.K. is.....guess what, we're stuffed, and mega defence cuts coming, and the minister of defence even talking about merging services......WHAT :o Yep, he just said it on the BBC; mind you he'll probaly get filleted if he tries to touch the R.N.

Of course, Britains independent deterrent will be replaced/modernised, and I guess that makes sense as long as Putin is running Russia, and China is a threat, we'd be mad not to. But for the rest, its seeking partners, maybe outsourcing the maritime defence of the U.K. (above the waves) to Belgium??

I totally agree with you there john!

Very Good, advanced, precision Quality in latest technology is good to a vast degree when you want the very best equipment for your armed forces even when high cost of product means less to purchase. But if you got mass quantity of a product that maybe simple and not as technologically advanced as the other but is still very good and effective and most importantly cheap to mass produce for the job you can easily over run quality any time especially if the user/operators that have to use it are well trained and highly skilled.

Lets not forget WW II showed that allot and the best example as such was the German Panzer 4 & Tiger Tank Vs the soviet T-34 Tanks. In addition there are smaller and most simple of advance technology's that are available that can counteract and knock out much larger highly advanced complex technology's that are around and can be made so cheaply that you can have it made at a sweat shop in some down town slum, ghetto or suburb in Mumbai or Shanghai :lol:

While this isn't F-22 news, it is Lockheed Martin news. Gates just fired the general in charge of the F-35 program and is refusing to pay some 160 million in fees owed LM because the F-35 is behind schedule overbudget and overweight....... Oh yeah we can build a cheap combat aircraft that can be used by the Air Force, Navy and Marines. :rolleyes: I guess these jackasses never heard of the F-111 cluster fuck.